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Old Apr 11th 2013, 10:15 PM
Americano's Avatar
Americano Americano is offline
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Default Re: Degrees of homophobia

Originally Posted by Michael View Post
No, I think Americano is referring to the phenomena where pollsters find that apparently no one is racist because everyone says they are not.
Excellent example, especially so if there are civil and criminal penalties for being a declared racist and practicing it.
"No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people."
~H.L. Mencken~
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Old Apr 12th 2013, 12:45 AM
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NickKIELCEPoland NickKIELCEPoland is offline
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Default Re: Degrees of homophobia

Originally Posted by Americano View Post
Verbally subscribing to a popular politically correct issue has nothing to do with actual change. Change transpires when the culture dominating what becomes politically incorrect is no longer a majority. 95% of Poles are declared Catholics with over 50% of that number attending worship services.
Being Catholic does not automatically mean being homophobic (perhaps logically that would be the case, but it isn't).

Believe it or not 6-7 years ago it would be more politically correct in Poland to be homophobic than to be pro-gay. People actually used to be secretly pro-gay, so if it's true what your saying then that in itself is a real change.
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Old Apr 5th 2014, 04:15 AM
voiceoftheshires voiceoftheshires is offline
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Default Re: Degrees of homophobia

Originally Posted by NickKIELCEPoland View Post
This thread is a discussion about whether homophobia can have mild and strong degrees.

Also, I'm certainly not a homophobe, and would like the whole world to be completely non-discriminatory with regard to homosexuality - I also categorically think that homosexuality is perfectly okay, and I strongly dislike homophobia.

I believe that there are different degrees of homophobia.

I have taken into account two things;

1) the rhetoric used by the homophobe (assuming that verbal rhetoric represents genuine attitude).

2) the background / education of the homophobe.

Lech Walesa, the Polish democracy and human rights campaigner, is, what I'd call a mild homophobe. I base this opinion on these things.

1) rhetoric. This is what he has to say on homosexuality; "If my son was gay, he'd still be my son, but I'd pray for him to stop going down the wrong road." Definitely homophobic in my opinion, but far millder than the kind of aggressive rhetoric that I have seen from some homophobes.

2) background
-born in 1943, so from the elderly generation
-Polish - Slavic and therefore probably generally conservative, but with a tendency to follow Western philosophy
-staunchly Christian - say no more
-no higher education - and therefore especially susceptible to the above points

Then you have Christian clergymen like the one MeMyselfandI told us about who wants his Sunday school students to spit on gay people.

In my opinioni, Lech Walesa's brand of homophobia is milder than that of the Sunday school clergyman.

My conclusion is that there are degrees of homophobia and that Lech Walesa, while homophobic, belongs to the very mildest kind of homophobe - this I base on both rhetoric and background.

(and by the way, if anyone thinks I'm biased towards Walesa because I live in Poland, they haven't bothered to get to know me in any way, and I frankly can't be bothered to deal with that kind of nonsense)

So, now it's up to you, what do you think on this subject - are there degrees of homophobia, or is it simply a case of two sides - homophobes or non-homophobes?
Lech Walesa's statement is not homophobic, you confuse homophobia with a belief that homosexuality is wrong, they are not the same
I went to the woods because I wished to live deliberately... ...and not, when I came to die, discover that I had not lived.
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