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Old Aug 13th 2013, 04:03 PM
MeMyselfAndI MeMyselfAndI is offline
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Default The gays are leaving Russia



That's Aleksandr Kargaltsev or Alexander, whatever he calls himself now, a 27 year old Russian gay who left for America.


His story: http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/...icle-1.1041872


He was mentioned in a gay.ru article about whetehr gays should just leave Russia. he advocates for this, here he is at a meeting at the Russian Consulate in New York in 2012

"Friends, leave!"

71.2% of readers, I am assuming gays, since it is their publication, say, in a poll in the article, they are "constantly thinking of it [emigration]".

http://www.gay.ru/society/legislatio...kargalcev.html

Another article says more and more gays are leaving Russia, with, apparently, growing Russian-speaking gay communities in New York, Los Angeles, Berlin, Hamburg, Haifa, Tel-Aviv, as well as Toronto and Melbourne.

http://www.gay.ru/society/gay-geogra...ni-uehali.html

One comment on this article I found interesting:

Quote:
Александр Смирнов (26/07/2013 17:27) // "За чем они уезжают?" Эх, были бы средства, уехал бы! И "картинку в своём букваре..." не жалко. Родина меня не воспринимает, как защитника Отечества и гражданина -- зачем я ей? Через год -- мне 60. Есть, что вспомнить... Но хочется именно душевного спокойствия там, где термин "gay" не обуславливатся оскорблением!
Translation:

Comment by Aleksandr Smirnov:

"Oh, if I had the money, I would leave. The motherland does not accept me, as a citizen or defender [implying he had served in the military]. She does not want me. I will be 60 in a year [the "gay subculture" is assumed to only be a fad among certain young people here]. I have my memories. But I want spiritual peace, somewhere, where the term "gay" does not come with insults."

This was somewhat of a revelation for me... That a nearly 60 year old veteran can be a gay. Perhaps I am an ignorant Russian, I never realized this. Obviously this man had to hide what he is for much of his life, especially in the ranks. Must have been awful for him

Anyway, Putin should be happy, the gay problem seems to be solving itself. they are leaving our society in "drives and packs", as the second article states.
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Old Aug 13th 2013, 04:05 PM
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NickKIELCEPoland NickKIELCEPoland is offline
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Default Re: The gays are leaving Russia

And what do you think about this? I was just searching for your opinion, but I read the whole initial posting, and didn't find a trace of an opinion from you. It would be nice to hear one.
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Old Aug 13th 2013, 04:09 PM
MeMyselfAndI MeMyselfAndI is offline
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Default Re: The gays are leaving Russia

Quote:
Originally Posted by NickKIELCEPoland View Post
And what do you think about this? I was just searching for your opinion, but I read the whole initial posting, and didn't find a trace of an opinion from you. It would be nice to hear one.
I think maybe it is for the best, maybe they will have better lives out there, in the more progressive Western countries.

It is a loss for Russia, for sure. Some of them are talented and educated young people. Kargaltsev is a filmmaker. there are others. But, I suppose the government does no see it quite that way, to them, this is getting rid of a unwelcome bad element of our society.

But, mostly, I am still shocked about that Smirnov fellow...
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Old Aug 13th 2013, 04:18 PM
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NickKIELCEPoland NickKIELCEPoland is offline
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Default Re: The gays are leaving Russia

Quote:
Originally Posted by MeMyselfAndI View Post
I think maybe it is for the best, maybe they will have better lives out there, in the more progressive Western countries.

It is a loss for Russia, for sure. Some of them are talented and educated young people. Kargaltsev is a filmmaker. there are others. But, I suppose the government does no see it quite that way, to them, this is getting rid of a unwelcome bad element of our society.

But, mostly, I am still shocked about that Smirnov fellow...
Well, they are most welcome here in EU/NATO. And Chaikovsky might have been one of them, had he been alive today.
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Old Aug 13th 2013, 06:57 PM
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Default Re: The gays are leaving Russia

Quote:
Originally Posted by MeMyselfAndI View Post
I think maybe it is for the best, maybe they will have better lives out there, in the more progressive Western countries.

It is a loss for Russia, for sure. Some of them are talented and educated young people. Kargaltsev is a filmmaker. there are others. But, I suppose the government does no see it quite that way, to them, this is getting rid of a unwelcome bad element of our society.

But, mostly, I am still shocked about that Smirnov fellow...
Western countries have slowly learned that the gay population is disproportionately richer, better educated, artistically dynamic and have a strong entrepreneurial streak. That's why western governments tend to pander to the gay minority.

Boston is a good example of the effect. Inner-city Boston used to be a typical American inner-city ghetto. Then the gay community started to move into one inner-city neighborhood and ten years later, inner-city Boston is lively and dynamic once again, with upscale residents wanting to move downtown. Other cities noticed this pattern.
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Old Aug 13th 2013, 06:58 PM
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Default Re: The gays are leaving Russia

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Originally Posted by MeMyselfAndI View Post
Anyway, Putin should be happy, the gay problem seems to be solving itself. they are leaving our society in "drives and packs", as the second article states.
He won't be happy if a boycott of the Olympics is organized against Russia.

Don't rule it out - that movement is rising and gaining steam across several western countries. It could still happen.

Western Olympic teams are usually heavily 'infested' with [closeted] gay athletes.
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Old Aug 13th 2013, 08:40 PM
MeMyselfAndI MeMyselfAndI is offline
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Default Re: The gays are leaving Russia

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael View Post
He won't be happy if a boycott of the Olympics is organized against Russia.

Don't rule it out - that movement is rising and gaining steam across several western countries. It could still happen.

Western Olympic teams are usually heavily 'infested' with [closeted] gay athletes.
All the other homophobic countries would still come That would be great. We would be playing a Winter Olympics against Iran, Uganda, Belarus, all the -stans, probably China will still come too (but they are not so strong in winter sports, except figure skating). Probably Ukraine will show up as well, Yanukovich has the same legislation on propagating homosexuality as Putin, so I guess they do not like gays either Probably Armenia also, they are our friend and depend on our military keeping the evil Azerbaijanis and Turks away from them Maybe some of the other African countries that execute gays.

That will be a fun Olympics. The home team would win all the medals, given that almost all countries that could actually strongly compete, except Belarus, Ukraine, and Kazakhstan, which have reasonably good hockey teams and, in Belarus' case - skiers, will not be participating.

It will be great
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Old Aug 13th 2013, 11:00 PM
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Default Re: The gays are leaving Russia

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael View Post
Western countries have slowly learned that the gay population is disproportionately richer, better educated, artistically dynamic and have a strong entrepreneurial streak. That's why western governments tend to pander to the gay minority.

Boston is a good example of the effect. Inner-city Boston used to be a typical American inner-city ghetto. Then the gay community started to move into one inner-city neighborhood and ten years later, inner-city Boston is lively and dynamic once again, with upscale residents wanting to move downtown. Other cities noticed this pattern.
I worry about this in Ohio, actually. Our cities are very progressive and have vibrant cultural scenes, but our laws continue to be regressive. Aside from my basic philosophical support of equality, I worry that gay men and women will just decide that Ohio is not a good place to be.

I also worry about a female brain drain from Ohio, actually.

There are two "problems" for Russia here:

1. It is never good for a country (at least the authoritative government of a country) to have a vocal, and righteous, minority coalescing en ex terra.

2. If ever there were a "renewable" resource, sexuality is it, so...
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Old Aug 14th 2013, 12:11 AM
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NickKIELCEPoland NickKIELCEPoland is offline
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Default Re: The gays are leaving Russia

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael View Post
He won't be happy if a boycott of the Olympics is organized against Russia.

Don't rule it out - that movement is rising and gaining steam across several western countries. It could still happen.

Western Olympic teams are usually heavily 'infested' with [closeted] gay athletes.
There are several pro-gay people who don't want a boycot, but who would like the athletes who feel as they do to make some sort of point, while in Sochi.

I would be very surprised if there is a boycot.

But as far as I'm concerned, why not just boycot Russian vodka.
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Old Aug 14th 2013, 01:55 AM
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NickKIELCEPoland NickKIELCEPoland is offline
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Default Re: The gays are leaving Russia

Remember, the Russia's General Kutusov beat Napoleon in precisely this way.
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