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  #31  
Old Jan 26th 2013, 03:31 AM
shekib82 shekib82 is offline
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Default Re: homeland and harms street

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If the US doesn't bend to Saudi Arabian and Israeli mindsets. Wahhabi hatred of Shia doctrine is all-consuming while ultra-conservative Israeli political leadership requires the Iran Shia demon to pursue its agenda.
They both hate one another. But you are right, this whole Shia business helps the Israeli agenda for the region.
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  #32  
Old Jan 26th 2013, 03:33 AM
shekib82 shekib82 is offline
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That's only fair. The Sunnis have always been a massive and ongoing threat to the Shia. American idiocy after 911 is what raised Shia's relative power in the region by taking out Sunni-Saddam and replacing it with a Shia majority government in Iraq.

That rise in Shia power scares the Sunnis. That is good.
It is a good for whom? The best thing is for people to love in peace and not perpetual war.
Instead of addressing the Israeli Palestinian conflict Americans have created a proxy war between Sunnis and Shias.
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  #33  
Old Jan 26th 2013, 08:32 AM
Tom Palven Tom Palven is offline
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Default Re: homeland and harms street

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It is a good for whom? The best thing is for people to love in peace and not perpetual war.
Instead of addressing the Israeli Palestinian conflict Americans have created a proxy war between Sunnis and Shias.
This is something I'e been wondering about. Being a Hate the US Bureaucracy First member, it's not hard for me to believe that some of the Mid-East strife is due to a purposeful US "divide and conquer" strategy. The only problem with this theory, though, is that if this is the case the strategy would be working, and that would probably be almost unique in the recent history of the US State Dept.
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  #34  
Old Jan 26th 2013, 10:37 AM
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Default Re: homeland and harms street

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This is something I'e been wondering about. Being a Hate the US Bureaucracy First member, it's not hard for me to believe that some of the Mid-East strife is due to a purposeful US "divide and conquer" strategy. The only problem with this theory, though, is that if this is the case the strategy would be working, and that would probably be almost unique in the recent history of the US State Dept.
You have to go back to England dismantling the Ottoman Empire in a haphazard manner for its own purposes to really appreciate US and British State Department failures. Iraq was created following WW1. Saudi Arabia wasn't created until 1932, the same year oil was discovered there. Iran has been around since the Persian Empire for 4000 years.

Total lack of cultural comprehension by English colonial and US invading powers has created some massive geopolitical failures. France has its share of those failures as does Russia.
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  #35  
Old Jan 26th 2013, 10:53 AM
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Interesting that they should choose this time in Iran's history to make their journey. I mean they could wait a few years. Furthermore this is not a pillar of Islam and they have other places they could visit such as Iran.
They waited more than a few years. The majority are Iranians making pilgrimages to holy places in Iraq which had been denied to them since 1968 when the Ba'ath Party came into power. Sunni concern being any cohesion developing between majority Shia Iraqis and Shia Iran.
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  #36  
Old Jan 26th 2013, 10:53 AM
shekib82 shekib82 is offline
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Default Re: homeland and harms street

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You have to go back to England dismantling the Ottoman Empire in a haphazard manner for its own purposes to really appreciate US and British State Department failures. Iraq was created following WW1. Saudi Arabia wasn't created until 1932, the same year oil was discovered there. Iran has been around since the Persian Empire for 4000 years.

Total lack of cultural comprehension by English colonial and US invading powers has created some massive geopolitical failures. France has its share of those failures as does Russia.
the creation of Saudi Arabia is the best case to illustrate the British success in dividing and conquering the region.
Remember arabs wanted a unified nation from the gulf to the ocean.
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  #37  
Old Jan 26th 2013, 10:55 AM
shekib82 shekib82 is offline
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Default Re: homeland and harms street

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They waited more than a few years. The majority are Iranians making pilgrimages to holy places in Iraq which had been denied to them since 1968 when the Ba'ath Party came into power. Sunni concern being any cohesion developing between majority Shia Iraqis and Shia Iran.
they are already cohesive.
and the pilgrims could have waited some more time. Yet a lot are pilgrims, but a lot are agents.
You also hear of pilgrims being abducted in Syria. Why are they going to syria at this time? it is because some of them are agents who help the regime.
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  #38  
Old Jan 26th 2013, 12:13 PM
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Default Re: homeland and harms street

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the creation of Saudi Arabia is the best case to illustrate the British success in dividing and conquering the region.
Remember arabs wanted a unified nation from the gulf to the ocean.
In order to apply a "divide & conquer" strategy, the object must be unified to begin with in order to be divided. No such unity condition existed in the Middle East. The Ottomans themselves never permitted such unity. The Ottomans maintained a "divide" strategy for centuries preceding the arrival of Europeans in the Middle East.
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  #39  
Old Jan 26th 2013, 12:19 PM
shekib82 shekib82 is offline
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Default Re: homeland and harms street

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In order to apply a "divide & conquer" strategy, the object must be unified to begin with in order to be divided. No such unity condition existed in the Middle East. The Ottomans themselves never permitted such unity. The Ottomans maintained a "divide" strategy for centuries preceding the arrival of Europeans in the Middle East.
arabs and muslims in the middle east have lived in a single state ever since the time of the prophet. At the beginning of the last century they could have had their state under sharif hussein. the reason they didn't was because of the British backing the house of Saud.

Note: if you want to look at arab unity today, you need look no further than the ranks of al qaeda who include muslims and arabs from every race and nationality. Muslim unity exists today as it has for centuries, the only issue of dispute is when there are two or more trying to become rulers. Usually this is handled in war and the winner makes himself khalifa. That didn't happen after ww1 due to british intervention as i have said.
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  #40  
Old Jan 26th 2013, 12:21 PM
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Default Re: homeland and harms street

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Originally Posted by shekib82 View Post
they are already cohesive.
and the pilgrims could have waited some more time. Yet a lot are pilgrims, but a lot are agents.
You also hear of pilgrims being abducted in Syria. Why are they going to syria at this time? it is because some of them are agents who help the regime.
Any guesses as to the number of agents and actual pilgrims? There are millions of Iranians going to Iraq on pilgrimages.
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