Love vs. greed

[MeMyselfAndI]

Just something I've been thinking about.

It is popular to talk about true love, that this is what brings people together.

But, on the other hand, in a recent study here in Russia, it was found that for 85% of couples, the main reason for their relationship was 'familial unification' (when two prominent families in our society unite themselves through marrying their offspring to bring together their resources and influence), 'registration' (people, usually girls, from the countryside, marry young men from Moscow or Saint Petersburg in order to gain registration and be able to come and live here), money (young women marry wealthy, usually much older, men, to inherit their money once they die). Love was last in the list.

However, they have also found that the marriages for love suffer from the highest divorce rates. The lowest rates of divorce seem to be among people like Cossacks, who practice a form of pre-arranged marriage. Cossacks hold balls/dances for their young
http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/189590_10150162242266558_721246557_8606415_365215_ n.jpg
http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/189590_10150162242276558_721246557_8606417_6264796 _n.jpg
Fathers bring their sons and daughters there and watch them dance. If the parents of a young man and those of the girl he is partnered with see that they look good together and move well together, in unison; those two will be married later on.

True love has very little to do with such a process, since the two young people may be from different communities, and may have never seen each other before.

Marriages for money, influence, or convenience, in this country at least, seem to hold together much better than 'real love' ones.

So, what do you think, does love matter?

[WFCY]

That one in pink- would hit with the angry fist of god

that being said, ppl who got together for love usually have the freedom of choice, which means it is easier for them to divorce. ppl who had arranged marriage, do not, and therefore cannot divorce even if they want to. and those who got together for status or money, well, obviously they will not divorce as long as status or money are still there and its value overweighs their personal feelings about the other.

so you cannot draw a direct connection between love and divorce rates while excluding those influential elements.

[MeMyselfAndI]

That one in pink- would hit with the angry fist of god

that being said, ppl who got together for love usually have the freedom of choice, which means it is easier for them to divorce. ppl who had arranged marriage, do not, and therefore cannot divorce even if they want to. and those who got together for status or money, well, obviously they will not divorce as long as status or money are still there and its value overweighs their personal feelings about the other.

so you cannot draw a direct connection between love and divorce rates while excluding those influential elements.

True. Well, I think that a good marriage is one that has the elements of both. As in, they do love each other, but are also good for each other in terms of financial and other characteristics.

And arranged marriages work as long as the parents or whoever makes the 'arrangement' is wise enough to pick well. :)

[Margot]

My mother once tried to sell me off for a pair of goats. I keep hoping that one day she'll be successful, but so far no dice. Oh well.

I'm with WFCY on this, though (I even agree that the young lady in pink is absolutely gorgeous--at least I think that's what he's saying).

The more autonomous each individual in a relationship is, the more likely each person will act, well, autonomously.

[Michael]

It makes sense that such marriages for reasons other than 'love' last longer.

The question is, are people happy with those arranged marriages?

Fact is, rates of adultery are notoriously high (and socially accepted) in places where arranged marriages are the norm.

[The Drunk Guy]

My mother once tried to sell me off for a pair of goats. I keep hoping that one day she'll be successful, but so far no dice. Oh well.
Hey, I offered her three goats, but she said no deal cause the fuckin' serial numbers are scratched off. :mad:
I'm with WFCY on this, though (I even agree that the young lady in pink is absolutely gorgeous--at least I think that's what he's saying).

Which one? (Until things get clarified, I'm assuming pedophilia and its the girl in pink with the pink fan slightly over her face.)

[The Drunk Guy]

I agree that marriage means different things to different cultures/personalities.

[JHC]

That one in pink- would hit with the angry fist of god

that being said, ppl who got together for love usually have the freedom of choice, which means it is easier for them to divorce. ppl who had arranged marriage, do not, and therefore cannot divorce even if they want to. and those who got together for status or money, well, obviously they will not divorce as long as status or money are still there and its value overweighs their personal feelings about the other.

so you cannot draw a direct connection between love and divorce rates while excluding those influential elements.Jesus. They're all in pink except the men. Then again, if I were you I'd say the same and mean it about every one. They are all very beautiful.

[JHC]

I don't believe in marriage for love.

Love is usually passion at that age and grows into something different in each relationship. This can be had through arranged marriages as well.

I agree with Margot. The key to successful marriage either is autonomy or an absolutely strict social structure. And by successful, I mean non-divorced. Happy=autonomy.

[JHC]

Hey, I offered her three goats, but she said no deal cause the fuckin' serial numbers are scratched off. :mad:

Which one? (Until things get clarified, I'm assuming pedophilia and its the girl in pink with the pink fan slightly over her face.)

What? You did? Am I too late?

[The Drunk Guy]

What? You did? Am I too late?
Yes. I just completed my order of the one in pink.

[MeMyselfAndI]

Jesus. They're all in pink except the men. Then again, if I were you I'd say the same and mean it about every one. They are all very beautiful.

Cossack women are renowned for their beauty. I believe it is a mix of Slav, North Caucasian, and (in Kuban Cossacks who live next door to huge tabors, Gypsie tribes, in Krasnodar) Roma/Gypsies blood in their veins.
http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/183533_10150152390086558_721246557_8515855_1631391 _n.jpghttp://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/40149_480738686557_721246557_7237561_4311529_n.jpg
http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/32494_434590831557_721246557_6049788_6936922_n.jpg http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/32494_434589596557_721246557_6049751_3225482_n.jpg
http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/32494_434589896557_721246557_6049754_2437838_n.jpg

Mikhail Shufutinsky, one of our country's most famous singers, sings a serenade to a kazachka (Cossack woman). many men dream about them.

But they don't marry outside their ethnic group. Kazachki are into macho men, and nobody can outmacho the Cossacks. Chechens can match them, maybe, which is why they have constant, violent fights if they live close to each other.

I don't believe in marriage for love.

Love is usually passion at that age and grows into something different in each relationship. This can be had through arranged marriages as well.

I agree with Margot. The key to successful marriage either is autonomy or an absolutely strict social structure. And by successful, I mean non-divorced. Happy=autonomy.

Agreed. But merit should be there too. Two 18 year olds getting married out of love, when neither of them even has their own place to live is ridiculous. No wonder such marriages rarely last. They do, however, create a lot of single mothers...

It makes sense that such marriages for reasons other than 'love' last longer.

The question is, are people happy with those arranged marriages?

Fact is, rates of adultery are notoriously high (and socially accepted) in places where arranged marriages are the norm.

Vladimir Zhirinovsky (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Zhirinovsky) says that to forevr fix such issues as adultery, as well as solve many demographic problems, Russia should legalize polygamy :D

Well, seriously though, many Chechens do it, polygamy is legal in Chechnya, Ramzan Kadyrov has 3 or 4 wives. Bashkortostan has asked the Federal center for permission to allow polygamous marriages for the Muslim portion of its population. Why not do it countrywide, let people marry in whatever ways they want. Of course, than we'd have to start talking about homosexual marriage. NOBODY wants to go there... :)

[Michael]

Cossack women are renowned for their beauty...
http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/183533_10150152390086558_721246557_8515855_1631391 _n.jpg

The men are apparently not. ;)

[MeMyselfAndI]

The men are apparently not. ;)

Actually, by our standards, that is a handsome groom. :)

Our standrads are not very high though. I understand there is a social/dating site that accepts only 'beautiful' people, based in Europe, I forget the name, but they vote, men vote if it is a woman and vise versa. Russian women are always at the top there, for acceptance rates, 2nd, at least 3d place. Russian men are somewhere deep at the bottom lol But the Poles and Ukrainians do worse than we do, so it is fine :D

[WFCY]

those news pics arn't as impressive.

seems there were a lot of confusion about what I said, so let me clarify:

[MeMyselfAndI]

those news pics arn't as impressive.

seems there were a lot of confusion about what I said, so let me clarify:

I knew you meant her. I suppose the others here didn't.

P.S. I posted the ones with AKs (from one of their training camps), because I heard Americans like guns, women, and women with guns :)

[WFCY]

.... Of course, than we'd have to start talking about homosexual marriage. NOBODY wants to go there... :)

hmm, actually I do. A lot of ppl who read my posts before have constantly told me that I am a faggot, raving homosexual, etc

Oh well

[WFCY]

I knew you meant her. I suppose the others here didn't.

P.S. I posted the ones with AKs (from one of their training camps), because I heard Americans like guns, women, and women with guns :)

Those Americans have small penises, that's why they need guns to compensate it in pictures with their women.

[MeMyselfAndI]

Those Americans have small penises, that's why they need guns to compensate it in pictures with their women.

I suppose lol

hmm, actually I do. A lot of ppl who read my posts before have constantly told me that I am a faggot, raving homosexual, etc

Oh well

I mean nobody in Russia. People here are not very comfortable with homosexualism or acceptable of it.

Back in 2006, then-Mayor Yuri Luzhkov banned their Pride march, and they tried to march anyway, the homosexualists did. There were riots. The Orthodox Christian nationalists, Muslim fanatics, Jewish hardliners, Cossacks, neo-nazis, you name it, they all came out against the gays. It was crazy. Fights broke out everywhere. A openly homosexualist German Bunderstag member got beaten up by Cossacks. I think some gay activist from Australia was roughed up also, after he shouted nasty things at a Orthodox priest. Some nearby parishioners attacked him...

Since then, nobody wants to bring up homosexualists or their issues.

[WFCY]

Back in 2006, then-Mayor Yuri Luzhkov banned their Pride march, and they tried to march anyway, the homosexualists did. There were riots. The Orthodox Christian nationalists, Muslim fanatics, Jewish hardliners, Cossacks, neo-nazis, you name it, they all came out against the gays. It was crazy. Fights broke out everywhere. A openly homosexualist German Bunderstag member got beaten up by Cossacks. I think some gay activist from Australia was roughed up also, after he shouted nasty things at a Orthodox priest. Some nearby parishioners attacked him...

Since then, nobody wants to bring up homosexualists or their issues.

Great! We have a shat tonne of homophobic christian evangelicals who would love to live in a biggot's heaven like russia. Can we export them over there please? I am sure they will feel right at home with the orthodox, crossacks, and the nazis.

[MeMyselfAndI]

Great! We have a shat tonne of homophobic christian evangelicals who would love to live in a biggot's heaven like russia. Can we export them over there please? I am sure they will feel right at home with the orthodox, crossacks, and the nazis.

Sure. We'll send them to North Siberia. They need people up there, working hands. :)

[WFCY]

it's a deal then! :)

[The Drunk Guy]

Those Americans have small penises, that's why they need guns to compensate it in pictures with their women.
Easy for you to say, Mr Krautstein. ;)

[The Drunk Girl]

Those Americans have small penises, that's why they need guns to compensate it in pictures with their women.

I dated a German for over a year and he had a smaller dick than what I have seen in American men. Are you compensating/using being a smartass for something?:shrug:

[WFCY]

I dated a German for over a year and he had a smaller dick than what I have seen in American men. Are you compensating/using being a smartass for something?:shrug:

No.

I am a black man.

[The Drunk Girl]

No.

I am a black man.

Umm... No you're not.

The stereotype of black males doesn't fit either ;). Try again

[WFCY]

Umm... No you're not.

The stereotype of black males doesn't fit either ;). Try again

uh huh, I see. you must be a racist, these people always say "I don't see color".

[The Drunk Girl]

uh huh, I see. you must be a racist, these people always say "I don't see color".

Of course I am racist! The white part of me wants to hang the black part of me and kill all of me for being engaged to a white man.
:dumbass:

[The Drunk Girl]

And who are "these people"?!

[WFCY]

you, that racist part of you, obviously

and we know you like white men, thats why u marry one. poor me.

[The Drunk Girl]

you, that racist part of you, obviously

and we know you like white men, thats why u marry one. poor me.

You wouldnt stand a chance in hell with me. Race doesn't matter to me. Stupidity does.

[WFCY]

You wouldnt stand a chance in hell with me. Race doesn't matter to me. Stupidity does.

so what makes u think I want you? I already knew you weren't into black people 3 posts ago already. We poor folks.

I am just a sad guy with nothing but a huge penis and too much time on Michael's site, that is all. leave me be :\

[Donkey]

I don't believe in marriage for love.

Love is usually passion at that age and grows into something different in each relationship. This can be had through arranged marriages as well.

I agree with Margot. The key to successful marriage either is autonomy or an absolutely strict social structure. And by successful, I mean non-divorced. Happy=autonomy.

Could you elaborate on what you mean by autonomy? Cause if you mean what M-gozzle usually means, I probably disagree. ;)

I would say that "successful" marriage depends on interdependence on several levels (not financial).

[JHC]

The men are apparently not. ;)

Yes, he looks like my pest control technician (bug man), from Boston. Can't stand that guy.:rolleyes:

[Margot]

Yes, he looks like my pest control technician (bug man), from Boston. Can't stand that guy.:rolleyes:

:lol: (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-c9mlOrDhc4) <-click that fucker.

[JHC]

Could you elaborate on what you mean by autonomy? Cause if you mean what M-gozzle usually means, I probably disagree. ;)

I would say that "successful" marriage depends on interdependence on several levels (not financial).

Nope. I am with M-gozzle I think. Marriage is a spiritual commitment - a bond of fidelity. It is BFF with sex.

Each partner should maintain their own identity, pursue their own education (worldly, not just scholastically), and support one another for respective maximum achievement of both parties.

This is extremely difficult if one of the parties believes that this is a relationship of dependence.

For instance, lets say that your spouse is pursuing a graduate degree. This is something that she had intended to do before the marriage but didn't have the money to accomplish. She believes that your combined incomes will allow her to attain her goal although she is not dependent upon you to do this.

You, on the other hand, have married her because you would like to start a family and clearly, this can not be accomplished without a spouse. You are depending on her to be a mother figure as part of this marriage contract.
The two goals are in conflict. She may be able to reach hers without your combined efforts but if she becomes a mother, her goals are harder to achieve rather than easier.

You can not reach yours if you are depending on her to fill a certain role. Your goal specifically depends upon your partner and requires that your partner relinquish autonomy, take on a new role and new goals.

[JHC]

:lol: (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-c9mlOrDhc4) <-click that fucker.

OMG, I thought you were going to link to his personal video. Whew.

[JHC]

so what makes u think I want you? I already knew you weren't into black people 3 posts ago already. We poor folks.

I am just a sad guy with nothing but a huge penis and too much time on Michael's site, that is all. leave me be :\

Because all black men lust after white women. Ambers white-ish.
AmIright?
:shrug:
I figured if we were going for stereotypes...
Too much?

[Margot]

Because all black men lust after white women. Ambers white-ish.
AmIright?
:shrug:
I figured if we were going for stereotypes...
Too much?

OHMYGOD, are we playing the stereotype game?! I have one about asian men! :D

[WFCY]

Because all black men lust after white women. Ambers white-ish.
AmIright?

And fat ones too. Really really fat ones. U have to remember that my ancesters are from Ghana and fat white women look like our ancient ivory godesses of fertility.

[WFCY]

OHMYGOD, are we playing the stereotype game?! I have one about asian men! :D

yes, what do chinese parents name their retarded kid?

Som Ting Wong

[Donkey]

Nope. I am with M-gozzle I think. Marriage is a spiritual commitment - a bond of fidelity. It is BFF with sex.

Each partner should maintain their own identity, pursue their own education (worldly, not just scholastically), and support one another for respective maximum achievement of both parties.

This is extremely difficult if one of the parties believes that this is a relationship of dependence.

For instance, lets say that your spouse is pursuing a graduate degree. This is something that she had intended to do before the marriage but didn't have the money to accomplish. She believes that your combined incomes will allow her to attain her goal although she is not dependent upon you to do this.

You, on the other hand, have married her because you would like to start a family and clearly, this can not be accomplished without a spouse. You are depending on her to be a mother figure as part of this marriage contract.
The two goals are in conflict. She may be able to reach hers without your combined efforts but if she becomes a mother, her goals are harder to achieve rather than easier.

You can not reach yours if you are depending on her to fill a certain role. Your goal specifically depends upon your partner and requires that your partner relinquish autonomy, take on a new role and new goals.

Well, I think what you describe is pretty specifically NOT interdependence.

But in your scenario, there is clearly a lack of understanding of mutual goals between that couple, and they shouldn't fuckin' get married in the first place.

[Margot]

yes, what do chinese parents name their retarded kid?

Som Ting Wong

http://files.sharenator.com/lol_face_Your_MumMom_Jokes-s274x280-119842-535.jpg

[MeMyselfAndI]

Yes, he looks like my pest control technician (bug man), from Boston. Can't stand that guy.:rolleyes:

lol He doesn't have The Moustache yet.

Cossacks are famous for their facial hair
http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/185881_10150149035711558_721246557_8482152_4219686 _n.jpg
http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/183533_10150152390091558_721246557_8515856_2336597 _n.jpghttp://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/40149_480738701557_721246557_7237564_3430780_n.jpg
And the oseledec haircut too... But particularly the mustache. For Cossacks, it is a matter of personal pride :) Married men have to have one.

[JHC]

lol He doesn't have The Moustache yet.

Cossacks are famous for their facial hair
http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/185881_10150149035711558_721246557_8482152_4219686 _n.jpg
http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/183533_10150152390091558_721246557_8515856_2336597 _n.jpghttp://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/40149_480738701557_721246557_7237564_3430780_n.jpg
And the oseledec haircut too... But particularly the mustache. For Cossacks, it is a matter of personal pride :) Married men have to have one.

No.

Sorry, just... no.

I think I would be a lesbian if I were Cossack.

[Donkey]

I'd bang the fu-man-chu, mohawk, pipe smoker. ;)

[JHC]

I'd bang the fu-man-chu, mohawk, pipe smoker. ;)

He looks a bit like Sean Connery. But the fucking mohawk has got to go.

[MeMyselfAndI]

No.

Sorry, just... no.

I think I would be a lesbian if I were Cossack.

lol Like I said, our women have different standards than yours.

I'd bang the fu-man-chu, mohawk, pipe smoker. ;)

Not mohawk, oseledec. What they do is, shave off all the head except leave a sort of 'tail' hanging off from above the forehead.
http://img0.liveinternet.ru/images/attach/c/0//45/951/45951300_6a40b45d3b.jpg

This is mostly popular among Cossacks in Kuban/Krasnodar region, near Ukraine, as well as Ukrainian Cossacks. Don and other 'Russian' Cossacks don't do this.

[Margot]

http://img0.liveinternet.ru/images/attach/c/0//45/951/45951300_6a40b45d3b.jpg



This. Is. AWESOME.

[Donkey]

He looks a bit like Sean Connery. But the fucking mohawk has got to go.
No fucking way. It's the best part.
lol Like I said, our women have different standards than yours.



Not mohawk, oseledec. What they do is, shave off all the head except leave a sort of 'tail' hanging off from above the forehead.
http://img0.liveinternet.ru/images/attach/c/0//45/951/45951300_6a40b45d3b.jpg

This is mostly popular among Cossacks in Kuban/Krasnodar region, near Ukraine, as well as Ukrainian Cossacks. Don and other 'Russian' Cossacks don't do this.
Clearly you are not familiar with American terminology... Mohawk, faux-hawk, bro-hawk, fro-hawk...

This one would be, I suppose, a cos-hawk. :D

[Donkey]

Hmm... I think I would look badass with this oseledec.

[MeMyselfAndI]

No fucking way. It's the best part.

Clearly you are not familiar with American terminology... Mohawk, faux-hawk, bro-hawk, fro-hawk...

This one would be, I suppose, a cos-hawk. :D

I know what you mean. Only we call that 'irokez'
http://img1.liveinternet.ru/images/attach/c/0/30/663/30663942_DSC03075.jpg
I believe the name, our name, comes from a tribe of Indians that once lived in North America. They wore their feathers that way.

[MeMyselfAndI]

Hmm... I think I would look badass with this oseledec.

Try it ;)

[MeMyselfAndI]

This. Is. AWESOME.

Yeah, they are awesome people. But stuck-up. They teach their children that 'being born Cossack is a privilege, everyone else in this country envies us, because they wish they were born as us, so always be proud of your heritage'...

[The Drunk Girl]

Because all black men lust after white women. Ambers white-ish.
AmIright?
:shrug:
I figured if we were going for stereotypes...
Too much?

Not for me :)

[Donkey]

I know what you mean. Only we call that 'irokez'

I believe the name, our name, comes from a tribe of Indians that once lived in North America. They wore their feathers that way.
Irokez eh? I think that would be our Iroquois. The Iroquois were actually a confederation of tribes. The term "Mohawk" also comes from a native American tribe... the Mohawk Indians, which were part of the Iroquois nation.


Try it ;)

I think if I cut off all my hair, my girlfriend would cut off the rest of my head.

[MeMyselfAndI]

I think if I cut off all my hair, my girlfriend would cut off the rest of my head.

My wife likes that I can cut my own hair. Most men here either expect their woman to cut his hair, or go to barber. To wives, the first means more work, the second means spending money, and both are bad. I save my Karina from both, and she is grateful, so does not care much what style I choose, as long as it is not too embarrassing.

[Donkey]

My wife likes that I can cut my own hair. Most men here either expect their woman to cut his hair, or go to barber. To wives, the first means more work, the second means spending money, and both are bad. I save my Karina from both, and she is grateful, so does not care much what style I choose, as long as it is not too embarrassing.

I get mine done by a Palestinian friend who comes over and does it for free. :D

[MeMyselfAndI]

I get mine done by a Palestinian friend who comes over and does it for free. :D

Our local barbershop is run by three young girls from Armenia, sisters. Very pretty girls. That is probably the main reason women here don't like their men going there lol

[Michael]

I know what you mean. Only we call that 'irokez'
...
I believe the name, our name, comes from a tribe of Indians that once lived in North America. They wore their feathers that way.
Indeed. That would be the Iroquois tribe.

In case you are curious, they were part of the Six Nations Confederacy (that includes the Mohawks as well) and this group of natives were, by far, the most politically and militarily advanced of all native American indian tribes at the time of arrive of Europeans.

Their home territory spans the lower Great Lakes and the St. Lawrence River.

Btw, one of the main reasons that Canada ultimately ended up British/English and not belonging to France/French is due to the military alliance between the Iroquois and the British.

The American invasion of Canada of 1812 was defeated by a very small numbers of British troops along with large numbers of irregular militia and Iroquois troops.

[Margot]

Yeah, they are awesome people. But stuck-up. They teach their children that 'being born Cossack is a privilege, everyone else in this country envies us, because they wish they were born as us, so always be proud of your heritage'...

They sound like Americans. :rolleyes:

[evanescence]

Just something I've been thinking about.

It is popular to talk about true love, that this is what brings people together.

But, on the other hand, in a recent study here in Russia, it was found that for 85% of couples, the main reason for their relationship was 'familial unification' (when two prominent families in our society unite themselves through marrying their offspring to bring together their resources and influence), 'registration' (people, usually girls, from the countryside, marry young men from Moscow or Saint Petersburg in order to gain registration and be able to come and live here), money (young women marry wealthy, usually much older, men, to inherit their money once they die). Love was last in the list.

However, they have also found that the marriages for love suffer from the highest divorce rates. The lowest rates of divorce seem to be among people like Cossacks, who practice a form of pre-arranged marriage. Cossacks hold balls/dances for their young
http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/189590_10150162242266558_721246557_8606415_365215_ n.jpg
http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/189590_10150162242276558_721246557_8606417_6264796 _n.jpg
Fathers bring their sons and daughters there and watch them dance. If the parents of a young man and those of the girl he is partnered with see that they look good together and move well together, in unison; those two will be married later on.

True love has very little to do with such a process, since the two young people may be from different communities, and may have never seen each other before.

Marriages for money, influence, or convenience, in this country at least, seem to hold together much better than 'real love' ones.

So, what do you think, does love matter?

I doubt there are many marriages based on true love but rather lust. People in the US in particular tend to be fake. Neither person is honest but instead pretend to be the person they think the other person wants them to be. After they get married, it becomes too difficult to hide the truth. Then there's adultery. People pretend to uphold monogamy while secretly fucking other people. I've had several guys tell me that the women that flirt with them the most are married. People get married with the expectation that their entire marriage will be like their dating experience. As soon as the "newness" is gone, they look for someone else to fulfill their "needs."
Also, it may just be the difference in cultures. Russians seem to have a very rich culture going back hundreds of years, full of tradition. Americans don't have a real culture, and everything is based on convenience or lies. I wish I could be from a country with a high context culture like Russia or Japan. Here it feels so shallow when I look in on others who truly have something to be proud of.

[Margot]

I wish I could be from a country with a high context culture like Russia or Japan.

I think that would probably be counterproductive.

[Donkey]

I think that would probably be counterproductive.

Suicide and fascism yaaaaay.

[The Drunk Girl]

Suicide and fascism yaaaaay.

Eh-hem...you forgot vodka and hibachi

[Donkey]

Eh-hem...you forgot vodka and hibachi

If we're basing national pride on booze and delicious food, the USA has plenty to be proud of.

[The Drunk Girl]

If we're basing national pride on booze and delicious food, the USA has plenty to be proud of.

True, I suppose. Kentucky alone has Woodford, Buffalo, Jim...KFC

However, I was just trying to make a funny

[Donkey]

True, I suppose. Kentucky alone has Woodford, Buffalo, Jim...KFC

However, I was just trying to make a funny

I know. So was I. :p

[The Drunk Girl]

I know. So was I. :p

:)

(Hard to tell the tone sometimes)

[MeMyselfAndI]

I doubt there are many marriages based on true love but rather lust. People in the US in particular tend to be fake. Neither person is honest but instead pretend to be the person they think the other person wants them to be. After they get married, it becomes too difficult to hide the truth. Then there's adultery. People pretend to uphold monogamy while secretly fucking other people. I've had several guys tell me that the women that flirt with them the most are married. People get married with the expectation that their entire marriage will be like their dating experience. As soon as the "newness" is gone, they look for someone else to fulfill their "needs."
Also, it may just be the difference in cultures. Russians seem to have a very rich culture going back hundreds of years, full of tradition. Americans don't have a real culture, and everything is based on convenience or lies. I wish I could be from a country with a high context culture like Russia or Japan. Here it feels so shallow when I look in on others who truly have something to be proud of.

The whole 'rich culture' and 'tradition' is only left in certain areas. Among the Cossacks. Among Dukhobors/Old Wayers. In Siberian villages. Those are places where people cherish and protect their roots.

That's where people still jump into ice-cold water during God's Christening
http://www.gazeta.lv/images/img_8620.jpghttp://www.gazeta.lv/images/_____A_Kreshchenie_7.jpg

Where they still have wooden churches
http://www.gazeta.lv/images/_____A_Kreshchenie_5.jpg

Where women and girls still cover their hair when they go out
http://www.molodoj.ru/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/gar1.jpg
Russian Orthodox Christianity used to be like Islam once, in that regard. In small, far away communities, it is still true, a female must not show her hair in public, it is shameful, indecent.

Children there still walk to school, since there is no other transport
http://www.molodoj.ru/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/gar4.jpg

Sadly, much of the old ways of life are gone now. I blame urbanization. Just recently, the government published the preliminary results of the 2010 Census. 75% of the population are now in the cities. Hundred years ago, in 1911, 86% of the population lived in rural areas.

I am not German Sterligov, I have no illusions about Russia 'returning to villages'. But I think this huge urbanization has hurt our country.

[evanescence]

So rich culture and urbanization cannot go together?


I think that would probably be counterproductive.

Why?

[MeMyselfAndI]

So rich culture and urbanization cannot go together?

No. At least not here. In the cities, people mix together, most forget their culture, their ways. There is no such attachment to family or faith here. I know that I have lost a lot of my heritage since I moved to Moscow. Visiting with my Northern, Dukhobor family on New Year, I found I could not follow my father in prayer. My brothers could. They still live in the village, they remember the words. I don't.

That's how it is.

[Michael]

No. At least not here. In the cities, people mix together, most forget their culture, their ways. There is no such attachment to family or faith here. I know that I have lost a lot of my heritage since I moved to Moscow. Visiting with my Northern, Dukhobor family on New Year, I found I could not follow my father in prayer. My brothers could. They still live in the village, they remember the words. I don't.

That's how it is.

As they said back in the Middle Ages - town air makes a man free.

For many people, that freedom is very unsettling and they yearn for the predictable and ancient traditions of rural living.

[MeMyselfAndI]

As they said back in the Middle Ages - town air makes a man free.

For many people, that freedom is very unsettling and they yearn for the predictable and ancient traditions of rural living.

Yeah... But, urbanization has had bad effects. Especially on demography. Just to compare, rural fertility rates in Russia range from 1.9 to 3.4 children per women, and for some peoples, like Cossacks, Chechens, and Tyvans, go up 6 to 8 to even sometimes 10 per woman. Highest for ethnic Russians is 3.1 per woman in Yamalo-Nenents Autonomous Okrug, in the Far North, our neighbors. Urban fertility rates go between 1.6 (Moscow) to, highest for ethnic Russians, 2.3, in Irkutsk, South-Eastern Siberia to 2.8 in Chechnya and Ingushetia. That's an increase, actually, an improvement. Just two years ago, our population was shrinking, because people in the cities were not having enough children. Demographic Crisis it was called. Today countries like Japan, Germany, or, for that matter, our good neighbor Ukraine, are in worse situation. Anyway, there is that. Just for example, my older brother, Vitaliy, has 9 children
http://images03.olx.ru/ui/9/10/38/1288604510_133630238_1----12--1288604510.jpg

My younger brother, they already have 3, and are execting number 4 soon
http://www.mnogodetok.ru/download/file.php?id=29624&mode=view

Me and Karina are still on only our second, and thinking about a 3d. Her sister has 5 children too, Tatars also like large families, plus, they are Muslims, Muslims always have lots of children :D

It is a big deal here, you know. There is even a forum: http://www.mnogodetok.ru/ Forum for parents of large families, or those wishing to become such. People from every part of the country there, including my younger brother. The government understands now that people like that need to be supported, they even brought back the Hero of Motherhood award they gave out in the Soviet Union to women who gave birth to 4 or more children.

But, in the cities, there is no space for a large family, everyone and everything is crammed. Peopel who want to have many offspring move to the countryside. Many take over empty land in Siberia and such places. You can say there is a de-urbanization going on, actually lol

[Michael]

The birthrate is ALWAYS directly proportional to relative wealth. Poor people have LOTS of children, rich people don't. There is literally mountains of research data that supports this assessment.

Ergo, the fall in the birthrate with increasing urbanization is not caused by urbanization itself - it is caused by the increase in relative wealth that is associated with urbanization.

[evanescence]

No. At least not here. In the cities, people mix together, most forget their culture, their ways. There is no such attachment to family or faith here. I know that I have lost a lot of my heritage since I moved to Moscow. Visiting with my Northern, Dukhobor family on New Year, I found I could not follow my father in prayer. My brothers could. They still live in the village, they remember the words. I don't.

That's how it is.

I've always hated urban living. The only thing good about it is the anonymity. In small towns, everyone knows everyone's else's business-which I hate. But at the same time, I can't stand indifference. I don't think there's a place on earth where I fit in since indifference and anonymity go together.

As they said back in the Middle Ages - town air makes a man free.

For many people, that freedom is very unsettling and they yearn for the predictable and ancient traditions of rural living.

The birthrate is ALWAYS directly proportional to relative wealth. Poor people have LOTS of children, rich people don't. There is literally mountains of research data that supports this assessment.

Ergo, the fall in the birthrate with increasing urbanization is not caused by urbanization itself - it is caused by the increase in relative wealth that is associated with urbanization.

It seems like an obvious assessment to me. Kids are like blackholes sucking every last ounce of time, energy, and money from their hosts..I mean parents. Then when they've taken everything, they still have their hand out wanting even more. I have two little kids. Another on the way which I plan to give up for adoption to my bf who is infertile. Oddly, in many cultures, I would be considered blessed because of my fertility and yet here, it's often a curse. It means poverty and mediocrity. I hope not to die poor. Probably will.

[MeMyselfAndI]

I've always hated urban living. The only thing good about it is the anonymity. In small towns, everyone knows everyone's else's business-which I hate. But at the same time, I can't stand indifference. I don't think there's a place on earth where I fit in since indifference and anonymity go together.





It seems like an obvious assessment to me. Kids are like blackholes sucking every last ounce of time, energy, and money from their hosts..I mean parents. Then when they've taken everything, they still have their hand out wanting even more. I have two little kids. Another on the way which I plan to give up for adoption to my bf who is infertile. Oddly, in many cultures, I would be considered blessed because of my fertility and yet here, it's often a curse. It means poverty and mediocrity. I hope not to die poor. Probably will.

A. I hate anonymity and indifference. People here don't even face each other in the elevator. Noone knows or cares who their neighbors are. You walk on the street, rarely you see anyone smile. At a street stall, the vendor lady barks at you: 'Citizen, hurry up! Don't hold up the line!'. Always 'Hurry up!'. Everyone is in a rush here, nobody has time for anybody else...

B. No, in this country, having a large family garners respect, if anything. Cossacks, for example, almost all photographs they take of themselves are family photographs, with wife, with children
http://www.eroshka.ru/e107_files/public/1263667029_564_FT0__.jpg

A strong, large family is the basic building block of a healthy society. Fact.

[evanescence]

A. I hate anonymity and indifference. People here don't even face each other in the elevator. Noone knows or cares who their neighbors are. You walk on the street, rarely you see anyone smile. At a street stall, the vendor lady barks at you: 'Citizen, hurry up! Don't hold up the line!'. Always 'Hurry up!'. Everyone is in a rush here, nobody has time for anybody else...

B. No, in this country, having a large family garners respect, if anything. Cossacks, for example, almost all photographs they take of themselves are family photographs, with wife, with children
http://www.eroshka.ru/e107_files/public/1263667029_564_FT0__.jpg

A strong, large family is the basic building block of a healthy society. Fact.

here in the US, welfare trash and rednecks have lots of kids. It doesn't garner much respect at all. And people definitely don't matter to each other. I rarely if ever find anyone who can be relied upon to honor their word or help a friend in need. It's sad times we're living in..truly.

[MeMyselfAndI]

here in the US, welfare trash and rednecks have lots of kids. It doesn't garner much respect at all. And people definitely don't matter to each other. I rarely if ever find anyone who can be relied upon to honor their word or help a friend in need. It's sad times we're living in..truly.

Here, it is religious people who both have most own children and also adopt the most. True for Orthodox Christians, Muslims, Buddhists. The more faithful the couple, more offspring will come of it.

Atheists are dying out :)

[evanescence]

Here, it is religious people who both have most own children and also adopt the most. True for Orthodox Christians, Muslims, Buddhists. The more faithful the couple, more offspring will come of it.

Atheists are dying out :)

I'm an atheist breeder. :lol:

[MeMyselfAndI]

I'm an atheist breeder. :lol:

I guess there are different reasons. Not only religious, but cultural. In Siberia, the Tyvans have biggest families.
http://www.centerasia.ru/uploads/posts/2011-01/thumbs/1295007398_4.jpghttp://www.ecology.md/pics/2010/02/news_putin11.jpg

That's because in Tyva, they believe that a person who doesn't have children is one who has wasted their life, therefore, their shamans say, such a person's spirit will not be reborn, as they are not worth it :)

[evanescence]

I guess there are different reasons. Not only religious, but cultural. In Siberia, the Tyvans have biggest families.
http://www.centerasia.ru/uploads/posts/2011-01/thumbs/1295007398_4.jpghttp://www.ecology.md/pics/2010/02/news_putin11.jpg

That's because in Tyva, they believe that a person who doesn't have children is one who has wasted their life, therefore, their shamans say, such a person's spirit will not be reborn, as they are not worth it :)

For me, my kids were mostly accidents, and I'm not the patient, motherly type either. Kids mean genetic immorality, and since I'm an atheist, I believe the purpose of life is replication. I don't even like kids, especially toddlers. They're dirty, loud, and they smell.

[Americano]

A. I hate anonymity and indifference. People here don't even face each other in the elevator. Noone knows or cares who their neighbors are. You walk on the street, rarely you see anyone smile. At a street stall, the vendor lady barks at you: 'Citizen, hurry up! Don't hold up the line!'. Always 'Hurry up!'. Everyone is in a rush here, nobody has time for anybody else...

B. No, in this country, having a large family garners respect, if anything. Cossacks, for example, almost all photographs they take of themselves are family photographs, with wife, with children
http://www.eroshka.ru/e107_files/public/1263667029_564_FT0__.jpg

A strong, large family is the basic building block of a healthy society. Fact.

Patriarchal society?

[Americano]

For me, my kids were mostly accidents, and I'm not the patient, motherly type either. Kids mean genetic immorality, and since I'm an atheist, I believe the purpose of life is replication. I don't even like kids, especially toddlers. They're dirty, loud, and they smell.

The very reason I suggested children be confined to airliner cargo sections.

[MeMyselfAndI]

Patriarchal society?

Cossack family values are simple, rigid, and to a Western eye, seem to come from another era. The men build the home and provide an income; the women cook, clean and give birth to children. Traditional Russian values, culture, and Orthodoxy form the bedrock of their beliefs.[60] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cossacks#cite_note-Russia.27s_Cossacks_rise_again-59)

Cossacks, particularly those in rural areas, tend to have more children than other Slavic or Christian peoples in Russia.


Rural Cossacks often live in large clans led by a elder patriarch, usually a grandfather, who often has the title of Ataman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ataman).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cossacks#Family_life

I would say so, yes.

They are very religious, of course, in fact, they are obsessed with faith, like Orthodox Christian Taliban
http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/199726_1932122584201_1276362109_32324436_4160653_n .jpghttp://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/181551_10150152391496558_721246557_8515867_934019_ n.jpghttp://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/35411_447531516557_721246557_6415874_7600246_n.jpg http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/40149_480738696557_721246557_7237563_4065388_n.jpg

[evanescence]

The very reason I suggested children be confined to airliner cargo sections.

:lol::lol: i just hate when people bring their brats on airplanes. i got stuck sitting in front of a screaming baby for several hours straight a few years ago and i wanted to tear my hair out. there should also be rules against children in certain restaurants.

[MeMyselfAndI]

:lol::lol: i just hate when people bring their brats on airplanes. i got stuck sitting in front of a screaming baby for several hours straight a few years ago and i wanted to tear my hair out. there should also be rules against children in certain restaurants.

I don't know if that's true in North America; but on most Russian air lines they have special areas, rows, devoted to parents with infants. Same like for smokers. So everyone is distributed 'by interest', so to speak. So, no complaints.

[Americano]

I don't know if that's true in North America; but on most Russian air lines they have special areas, rows, devoted to parents with infants. Same like for smokers. So everyone is distributed 'by interest', so to speak. So, no complaints.

In the US some parent would sue the airline for discrimination because their brat is 'special' and everyone should want to be near it.

On US airlines smoking is no longer allowed. That's a result of airlines discovering they can save thousands of dollars on cabin air filters replacement and a US public firmly convinced that smoking leads directly to lung cancer.

[evanescence]

I don't know if that's true in North America; but on most Russian air lines they have special areas, rows, devoted to parents with infants. Same like for smokers. So everyone is distributed 'by interest', so to speak. So, no complaints.

In the US some parent would sue the airline for discrimination because their brat is 'special' and everyone should want to be near it.

On US airlines smoking is no longer allowed. That's a result of airlines discovering they can save thousands of dollars on cabin air filters replacement and a US public firmly convinced that smoking leads directly to lung cancer.

Precisely. I wish Americans were capable of that kind of logic. It would make society so much more tolerable to me. But, yes smoking most certainly leads to lung cancer..

[MeMyselfAndI]

Well, I smoke on-and-off, and usually travel in the smoking section on domestic flights. Not just for the habit; but because, in my experience, in this country, best people tend to smoke. That's how I met my wife. I was a young representative of our security firm flying to Kazan, Tatarstan on business. Karina was a even younger university student, returning to Tatarstan from Moscow to visit her family. She was 18, I was 23. We ended up next to each other. Her lighter wouldn't work, I offered her mine, and a conversation started. I don't remember what about, but we laughed, a lot. Karina has this awesome laugh, like church bells, I remember that was the first thing taht struck me about her. In the end, we went our ways, but not before I wrote my telephone number in her little note book. Some time over the next month (it was New Year, actually), all my friends were gone, on vacations everywhere, I was alone and lonely, and she calls me, out of nowhere, asks if I want to come celebrate with her and her roommates at the Moscow University dorms. Well... New Year with a bunch of beautiful university girls. Seemed like fun lol I had to sneak past the mean old nightwatchwoman at the door. Brought champagne, flowers. From there, on it went. Now, ten years and two children later, I like to think whatever put us together is still there :)

I have a smoking seat on a TU-154 to thank for my marriage. God bless smoking sections :D

[Michael]

...But, yes smoking most certainly leads to lung cancer..
Except when it doesn't.

Best numbers I've seen suggest that 30 plus years of pack a day smoking runs a 7-10% risk of lung cancer.

[evanescence]

Except when it doesn't.

Best numbers I've seen suggest that 30 plus years of pack a day smoking runs a 7-10% risk of lung cancer.

o'rly? Got a link for that?

http://jnci.oxfordjournals.org/content/91/14/1194.full

[Americano]

Except when it doesn't.

Best numbers I've seen suggest that 30 plus years of pack a day smoking runs a 7-10% risk of lung cancer.

Far better odds than divorce in the US. .

[evanescence]

Someone should call the surgeon general! :lol:

[Americano]

Someone should call the surgeon general! :lol:

There's no tax potential on divorce. Yet.

[IrynaHarpy]

lol Like I said, our women have different standards than yours.



Not mohawk, oseledec. What they do is, shave off all the head except leave a sort of 'tail' hanging off from above the forehead.
http://img0.liveinternet.ru/images/attach/c/0//45/951/45951300_6a40b45d3b.jpg

This is mostly popular among Cossacks in Kuban/Krasnodar region, near Ukraine, as well as Ukrainian Cossacks. Don and other 'Russian' Cossacks don't do this.

If you don't mind my clarifying this issue, the 'oseledec' (oseledetz') is a relatively recent name for a 'chub' (the 'u' being pronounced as the 'oo' in 'book'). Oseledetz' means 'herring'. A 'chub' (meaning a 'tuft') was longer & thinner than as depicted in recent films. It was waxed & curled behind the ear for formal occasions; & the moustache also waxed.

While the original reason for this 'hairstyle' isn't known, old texts have demonstrated that the cossacks believed it would be easier for the angels to collect their souls from the battlefield if they had a 'chub' of hair to grab hold of.

While I've never been terribly fond of facial hair on men, there's something very attractive about a man with a shaven head & a well-groomed moustache!

http://mamayfest.at.ua/_si/0/74420.jpg

- Iryna (of an old Ukrainian Cossack family)